The newer 22s do have this extra power available above that placarded, the old ones have some but less so, Howver it should be used to get you out of the crap to prevent a crash, not as a matter of course. Metal has a memory !
The 206 is the same with normal operating at about 317shp and engine power available of 420shp. In the 206 you are virtually guaranteed to trash the gearbox if you use all the extra power. in the 22 the margin for error is lesser but its lighter.
The Lycoming engine manuals suggest NOT using carb heat if the OAT is below 14 Deg Fahrenheit (which is about -10 Deg C). Below this temperature they say the water in the air is already frozen.
The ATSB Carb icing probability chart suggests 38 Deg C as the upper limit of Light Carburettor Icing.
The reason I asked the question was that todays Gin Clear Blue Sky in London actually produced figures which leas to SEVERE Icing probable at any power setting. Several Carb Icing accidents have occured under similar condiions in the recent past and today was a good example of one that might catch some people out. All the instructors I spoke to who were in London or the surrounding area did not think that by looking out of the window they would have considered carb icing to be a problem today, which proved the point set out with this morning.
Joined: Apr 27, 2005 Posts: 449 Location: SE England
Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:57 pm Post subject:
Quote:
All the instructors I spoke to who were in London or the surrounding area did not think that by looking out of the window they would have considered carb icing to be a problem today
Which I find bizarre, because whenever I fly I always assume I am going to encounter sever carb icing. Particularly in the UK.
I flew today and as always kept the carb air temp at around 15 degrees and full carb heat for any descent. I can remember a few years back flying with the owner of an R22 who told me to reduce the temp to the yellow arc because it wasted too much power. I disagreed then and found my viewpoint to be correct when I attended the UK Robinson Flight Safety Course. I've flown the same way ever since. _________________ DBChopper
PPL(H) R22 R44
Redhill
crawling slowly towards the CPL(H)... finally starting the flying!
All the instructors I spoke to who were in London or the surrounding area did not think that by looking out of the window they would have considered carb icing to be a problem today, which proved the point set out with this morning.
Pardon?! Instructors?! That is astonishing! Rather serves to wholly justify your safety events Gary!
In the UK, just about EVERY DAY is a carb icing day....! We so rarely get temperatures hot enough to push it out of the zone.
I'm full of disbelief that Instructors, who presumably have CPL or ATPL, and then the FI course to boot, are oblivious of this. Bloody hell, even at ATC school, we were taught about the carb icing problem...!
Joined: Apr 27, 2005 Posts: 449 Location: SE England
Posted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 8:41 pm Post subject:
Quote:
DB He wasn't also an aeroplane pilot was he ?
No he wasn't - just not a very clever helicopter pilot (a subsequent flight with him in the driving seat proved that )
Edited to comment on JTL's post, seeing as we seem to post at the same time on most threads ...
I share your amazement. For a PPL not to comprehend the ever-present danger of carb ice is bad enough, particularly given the UK climate, but for an instructor (the vast majority these days who will be CPLs) not to is unforgiveable. And we wonder why people crash... _________________ DBChopper
PPL(H) R22 R44
Redhill
crawling slowly towards the CPL(H)... finally starting the flying!
In fairness to said instructors it wasn't that they didn't think there was any risk just not that it was a severe risk, which was my whole point to asking them, and they didn't get to see the METAR just to look out of the window before they went to work.
I am constantly surprised though by how little some pilots know about the aircraft they fly, we can't know everything but knowing more can always help I believe.
I have been discussing the idea of type specific stuff for the next round of safety evenings and all asked up to now think its a good idea, it will naturally feature the R22 quite heavily but will not be limited to it alone.
In fairness to said instructors it wasn't that they didn't think there was any risk just not that it was a severe risk, which was my whole point to asking them, and they didn't get to see the METAR just to look out of the window before they went to work.
Okay, so maybe that's a little better - but even still, there's some instinctive thing in me that thinks the further away from 40 degrees C, the higher the risk. Between 0C-10C, I would automatically consider the risk to be just about highest - severe if you like.
So, maybe the issue is more one of Meteorological understanding, which I do perhaps sympathise with a little more. Except, again, these are people who should have a relatively high level of understanding having reached CPL/ATPL level. Even then, common sense should prevail: It's March. With clear skies. It's not going to be shorts and tee-shirt weather, is it?
IGNORANCE IS NOT AN EXCUSE. Grrr. _________________ J.
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